When is a ban not a ban?
Thursday, July 2, 2009 Greece, we are informed, is the latest European country to adopt a ban on smoking in public places. According to Reuters, for example, "Greeks were banned from smoking at work and inside bars and restaurants on Wednesday".
Er, not quite. According to the same report:
"A last-minute amendment allows offices where more than 50 people work to have designated smoking areas. Restaurant and bar owners of properties of up to 70 square metres can decide whether their business is smoking or non smoking. Others can set up ventilated smoking areas."
I don't know about you, but I wouldn't be unhappy with a "ban" like that. Once again, the comprehensive ban in Britain and Ireland is shown to be draconian, unnecessary and out of step with most of the rest of Europe.
Full report HERE.
Reader Comments (10)
What the hell is it with the EU?
Why are we, here in the UK the only people to feel their full wrath? Is it because they know we are basically a stupid nation, a nation who believes anything and never fights back?
Even our MEPs are a disgrace, I have just composed a long reply to Doctor Tannock MEP over on the Conservative blog. The man is a moron who doesn't know a thing about passive smoking and its so-called effects.
These people are rulling us and earning masses of money in doing so. They know they can never get away with such draconian measures anywhere else in Europe, so they take it out on us, and we stand for it.
This is the one big issue where I totally agree with UKIP, but unfortunately, they are not going to make a big enough splash in our voting system to ever do much about it, and this is the reaso I think more people from here should be hammering home what they think about the EU and what they think about the smoking ban, over on the Conservative blog.
Make the Tories see that these issues are not something to ignore, and if they continue to do so, it could be at their own peril.
Quite agree Peter.Please everyone this is an ideal opportunity to make your feelings known. Get posting !
Peter - they are losing voters at their own peril. They already have - they have lost me because of their stance on both the smoking ban and the EU.
It doesn't appear as though they mind though
Sarah, if they have really lost you for the reasons you state, then get over there and let them know. http://conservativehome.blogs.com/platform/2009/07/shane-frith-why-you-should-support-the-campaign-to-amend-the-smoking-ban-.html#comment-6a00d83451b31c69e2011570abfda1970c
Thanks Peter - I just have. This is what I wrote:
I'm hoping that all tories support this campaign. I stopped voting for the tories for 2 reasons after voting for them all my life.
The main reason was because of their stance on the smoking ban, as though the debate was over.
The general public and many politicians may have been brainwashed by the grossly-funded and vested-interest propaganda, but I certainly haven't.
I cannot trust a party that will only listen to one side of a debate.
There is nothing wrong with having indoor facilities for both smokers and non-smokers alike. The majority of the rest of the world seem to manage it, so why can't we?
BTW, before anyone asks, my other reason for stopping voting for them was over their stance on the EU, but this was a secondary reason.
Seems to me that there always has to be a scapegoat in a situation.
Nowhere is this more prevalent than with govt policy and anyone unfortunate enough to be caught in the clutches of the EU like England and Ireland.
As the EU had to have an example i.e. scapegoat when they brought in the smoking ban, to hold up to the rest of europe, they did a psychological study of european countries and realised that England and Ireland were the likliest patsies.
England for its law and order and love of fair play and trust.
And Ireland for its stupidity, greed, and belief that they were going to be trend setters and world leaders and up there with other european countries they think are superior.
But now that Ireland is on its knees I doubt if any other country will be copying our ground breaking inititives.
So Greece, like Spain and all the other continental countries with a strong cultural background, can afford to look upon us with pity and have a good laugh at us while they make their way to their bodegas and tavernas to light up for a peaceful smoke.
Will someone please tell me why I should support AWTs intiative to 'Save Our Pubs'Campaign? The Publicans have shown absolute cowardice and contempt for the customers. I have tried but got shot down in flames let them rot!!.
The sadness being a centuries old institution is being destroyed by a person who is obsessed with the economy.
No idea of how the domestic front operates.
I agree with Peter James that publicans were cowards. Publicans in England should have realised that the people of Scotland and Ireland, despite their advertising publicity, are NOT, generally speaking, pub-going people. I did not realise this until I went to St Andrews in Scotland to play golf several years ago. I was amazed and shocked to find that, in the town of St Andrews in June, despite the golf course being full of Americans and Japanese, the pubs were EMPTY. Weird, or what? That was when it stuck me, because I have often been to Scotland to play golf, that the VAST MAJORITY of scottish people NEVER go to their local pubs. They are, along with the Irish, essentially a PURITANICAL people. This is the reason that their governments can get away with their draconian laws - the people as a whole do not give a damn. In any case, especially in Ireland, if the locals decide that they will ignore the ban, they simply do so - and God help the local jobsworthy who reports them! We must remember that the countries of Scotland and Ireland are VAST, comparatively speaking, and sparsely populated and so virtually uncontrollable locally.
Publicans in Scotland and Ireland seem to be able to get by with only a very small customer base. Could this be because they have miniscule rents and miniscule rates, etc? I think so. In England, rents are massive, rates are massive, etc. Their profitability problems have nothing to do with supermarkets.
Having said all that, Peter James is quite correct. WHERE ARE THE PUBLICANS MARCHING IN DEFENCE OF THEIR LIVELYHOODS? It is much more important for publicans to march than for smokers to march. The effect of a FEW publicans marching could be relevent - the effect of many, but not very many, smokers would be laughable.
I have been onto the Conservative Home site this evening. Essentially, the points made by smokers are reasonable and relevent whereas the points made by non-smokers are hysterical and irrelevent (smelly clothes, etc).
I think that it is well worth our while to press our case on Conservative Home since the Blair Babes are so, well, passe - don't you think?
By the way, for regular posters, I used to be 'James Watson'. I changed my designaton because I was becoming confused with who I am!
Peter Thurgood asked:
"Why are we, here in the UK the only people to feel their full wrath?"
Well - after all, Puritanism *did* originate in your country. The ones who didn’t catch the Mayflower have bred and now their descendants are at it again... ;-)
This is their latest attempt:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/8129259.stm
Note the rhetoric: "adding to the burden on the NHS", "reduce alcohol-related hospital admissions", "a draft mandatory code".
And finally, this little gem: "an NHS study suggested that alcohol may have caused the death of twice as many Scots as previously thought." (Emphases mine.)
Sounds ever so familiar, doesn’t it?
Perhaps it’s time for a Mayflower II. A considerably bigger one.
I agree that it was an absolute shame that pub landlords didnt even give a bleet against the smoking ban when it was introduced and their silence since then has been astounding for its absence and shown for the cowards they are.
As regards Junican's point about the irish not being pub going people, that is only true post the smoking and drinking ban in 2004.
Up to then the pub was the only social scene for irish people and pubs were packed all over ireland. We didnt get the moniker 'the drunken irish' for nothing.
After that the rot set in when the EU wanted payback for the money and had our corrupt govt by the short and curlies.
With the influx of refugees/immigrants that overwhelmed us over a 10 year period (which took 50 years in england) political correctness and false money, people were divided and conquered and are still reeling as a consequence.
I cant speak for scotland's empty pubs, I always thought they were hard drinkers, but thrift may have something to do with it.
But the reason that pubs in ireland can remain open in these recessionery times is the fact that a lot of rural pubs are family owned, they own the premises and are usually run by the family.