Symbol of impotence
Wednesday, August 13, 2008 Suzy Dean is co-organiser of the Manifesto Club. Writing for The Free Society blog, Suzy, 22, attacks the government's war on alchol and complains that, "Far from trying to promote a continental style ‘cafe culture’ ... the UK’s political elite would rather try to control who can drink, how much and where, particularly when it comes to teenage drinking.
"Policy," she adds, "is increasingly geared, naively, towards trying to discourage young people from drinking at all rather than encouraging police to deal with silly behaviour with discretion ... Anti-drinking measures are today a symbol of government impotence rather than a nation of hedonists. With no sense of who the public are or how to connect with them in any meaningful way, they try to manage the trivial, everyday decisions."
Full article HERE.
Reader Comments (18)
Here is the comment I have just left regarding this article:
It is typical of an impotent government that their mantra is ‘Ban this and Ban that’!
In order for us to establish a Continental style cafe culture here in the UK then it will take at least a generation to achieve as it is a way of life, not just a mental state of mind.
My daughter, who is now 25, was brought up the Continental way (regardless of the law!) and from the age she sat in her high chair at the dining table, IF we had wine with our meal, so did she, in a very small quantity. If she chose to drink it straight down she did not get any more; if she sipped it, she got a little drop more.
At the age of 16 (her father having died when she was 13) she would phone me at work, after school, to ask if she could please have a lager shandy! She always made them really weak, but would not touch alcohol in the house without permission. I put this down to respect for me and the fact that she knew I would say yes. She never abused alcohol. Now she is training to be a Pub & Restaurant Manager. I am not saying she is an angel and has never got drunk, she has, usually when she and a boyfriend have broken up or perhaps on her birthday – like many people do. She does not go out and binge drink.
Here, the main problem, as I see it, is the clubs and I am sure then it is not just alcohol that is flowing! I also see the smoking ban as having an adverse effect because in many cases people are not allowed to take their drinks outside with them, so knock back their drink to go for a smoke and then order another drink once back inside, which is more than likely then finished in a rush so they can go out for another smoke! This in itself is breeding a whole new culture and reason for binge drinking!
Politicians need to start living in the real world, seeing it and experiencing it as us, the normal people do and then put their own houses in order before they start trying to put everyone elses lives in order! All they have done is make a right mess of it so far and are just digging a deeper and deeper hole that will finally cave in and bury them (with any luck pretty damn soon!)
I agree that the govt have lost touch with reality and have become totally detached from the people. With so many spin doctors and PR guros advising them and doing their jobs for them they are just mere figurheads drawing in big fat salaries and then they start to believe the propaganda themselves.
All the crazy antisocial bans to date prove it.
Isnt it about time that a balance was restored to the people. If the electorat have to put up with bans they're not happy with, why should we not ask for more accountability and transparency in return, like demanding a new criteria for elected representatives. For instance, every govt minister should have it in his contract to work for a month each year in a job relevant to his ministery. For instance the social welfare minister should work in the dole office and the health minister work in health once a year etc (work that is, not just oversee). God knows they would hardly be missed for a month.
The electorate should agitate for this, at least to get them back for the smoking ban if nothing else.
I like your idea Ann of ministers working for a month a year (that in itself is quite novel!), in a position connected with their ministery, but do you not think this may well cause complete and utter chaos?
The clerks and junior doctors and nurses, and so forth, have enough of a job to get things done whilst being bound hand and foot by the numbskulls in government, without being actually sabotaged in person!
Still, if a way round that problem could be found, it would be interesting to see how they cope with work, especially as work in the real world is nothing like what they deem to be work!
Of course it would cause chaos Lyn as they are thick as planks when it comes to the practical because they're so far removed from the ordinary people, but to quote their own spin doctors "lessons could be learned".
It would do them no harm and all and when I say work I mean at the coalface of the job, that is in a receptionist capacity, answering the phone and dealing with people who are waiting on chairs in hospitals or the dole office. I dont mean managerial level as they would probably close the business down through ineptitude.
Who knows, they might get such a dose of reality that it would soften them up a bit and they might give us a separate indoor smoking area in pubs (which is all us smokers want) when they realise that the little people havent got access to the same comfortable secret smoking room attached to their ministerial office.
And they might come to realise that a little bit of fair play might go a long way in the voting department too.
I take your point Ann, but don't you think they are likely to close down whatever company they worked for, if they had access to a computer?
Still, it would be really interesting to find out, although I don't suppose for a moment that any of them have the balls to try it!
Lyn and ann.
'A little knowledge is a dangerous thing'.
Norman LaMont went from Uni into banking. A short time after he went into politics and look what happened on Black Wednesday.
Too true I suppose as you cant make a silk purse from a sow's ear. I guess we'll just have to soldier on with the battle and rely on the old voting box for the only dose of reality they understand.
Mind you if you lived in ireland that wouldnt have any clout either after we were told by our govt and Sarkozy that our democratic No vote on the lisbon treaty was not acceptable.
Some encouragement.
When debating the ban with Kerry McArthy I decided to email the Conservative MP for Bristol North West. This is her reply.
Many thanks for your email regarding the smoking ban- and my apologies it's taken me a while to get back to you.
My views on the smoking ban are fairly simple - I do not support or encourage smoking but a blanket ban on smoking in all pubs is an unacceptable infringement on peoples' personal choice to live as they wish. Smokers are informed adults who are capable of calculating risk for themselves. I am not a smoker, my father is a doctor, and I am as concerned as anyone about the health effects smoking can have - particularly on children and those who can't make decisions for themselves, but to make smokers social pariahs is unacceptable.
There are so many other solutions that do not involve a ban ( and in particular, I find a ban on private clubs particularly abhorrent.) For example, there could have been an incentive for pubs to be non-smoking ( such as a tax-break) but allowing pubs that so wished to continue to be smoking pubs. These pubs would do so if they could attract enough smoking clientèle ( which I have no doubt many would) and would have become known as 'smoking pubs.' Staff who wished to smoke would be able to work in these pubs with a smoking clientèle, leaving a smoke free environment for those who preferred it. That is just one idea of getting round the problem, but I believe in personal choice, and banning responsible adults from smoking in all pubs flies in the face of that, and reveals a complete lack of respect for the electorate.
I hope this is of some help.
Best wishes
Charlotte Leslie
--
Charlotte Leslie
Conservative Prospective MP,
Bristol North West
How wonderfully sensible Charlotte Leslie is. What sweet reasonableness. What consideration. It's a breath of fresh air.
I just wish David Cameron was half as sensible as this MP. Or rather prospective MP. I hope she ousts Labour MP Doug Naysmith at the next election.
Boris and Idlex -
Thanks for the post(s).
A modern Tory MP sounding like a sensible conservative - can she be for real ?
Let's just hope that she's not in a minority of one - though I did find her references to The Needs Of The Children and her being The Daughter Of A Doctor (so ?) depressingly trite.
I wish that - just for once - SOMEBODY in public life would have the courage to offer the Pro-Choice campaign UNQUALIFIED support.
On balance, though, she DOES seem to be on the Side of the Angels - for now.
However, and at the risk of putting a dampener
on things, allow me to share the contents of an e-mail I've just received from Neil Williams of the British Beer and Pub Association:
"Dear Martin
Thanks for your message. Much of our work at the moment is around drawing attention to the plight of pubs, and pub closures, an we have attracted a lot of media attention to the issue in recent months We are developing further campaigns for the coming year, but we’re not campaigning for a reversal of the smoking ban, as we do not feel that this would be likely to achieve success, given the big majority in Parliament in favour of a complete ban.
Best regards
Neil Williams
Communications Manager
British Beer & Pub Association
020 7627 9156
As I replied to Mr Williams, it appears that it's NOT only the politicians who Just Don't Get It.....................
The BPBA clearly feels that it no longer needs OUR patronage in order to help its members survive.
Perhaps more bouncy castles and cheap Belgian lager will halt the destruction of the English pub in our stead ?
At any rate, that would seem to be ONE potential ally less that we can rely upon in the Struggle, I fear !
It sounds to me like Neil Williams is doing exactly what the politicians did - not listen to the people - in his case the landlords and managers of pubs!
I cannot believe for one moment that the destruction of the hospitality trade, coming as it did on the heels of the smoking ban, was just a coincidence!
Pity the Bear and Pub Association seem to allow traitors onto it's staff - as this seems to me be what Neil Williams is, a traitor, who during the war would have been shot!
Sorry for faux pas - should have been Beer and Pub Trade!
Association, even!
Lyn -
Not to worry: it's been a LONG day for me, too..................;-)
Anyone that makes a chink in the armour is a step up rather than down and I hope Charlotte Leslie is not just a minority of one in govt, but that Neil Williams is a lilly livered wanker of the first order. He and all people in the drinks trade should be the very ones to champion his customers plight - the people who keep him in his job in the first place. Instead of brown nosing himself with the politicians he and his ilk should be agitating for an indoor smoking room for smokers to save their pubs from extinction. And to apease the Ash nazis myth of passive smoking for bar workers, drinkers could get their own drinks from the bar. This is such a fair and simple solution that even an ash nazi would want to be very vindictive to object to. The cowering drinks trade should also ask the govt for scientific proof that passive smoking kills.
Is it any wonder the pub scene is in the state its in with useless articles like them at the helm. Maybe they're waiting for the recession to set in further to get punters back in the pub, as it's a sad but true fact that a recession is always good for the pub trade. And who knows, now that the big spend is coming to an end and people are forced to get practicle again they might not be too fussy about the smell of smoke in their hair or clothes from those dirty filthy smokers - maybe they might even like to light up themselves while drowning their sorrows!!
Ann -
Yes - depressing, isn't it ?
Just for ONCE, I'd like to receive a reply that sounds as though it's been written by a member of the Human Race - rather than by some android in a Sixties episode of 'Dr Who'.
I still live in hope (just).
You say that:
"..as it's a sad but true fact that a recession is always good for the pub trade."
Quite true - but I've a feeling that that formula won't work this time.
And if it did ?
Expect the following headline:
"SMOKING BAN A BOOST FOR PUB TRADE, SAYS MINISTER"
That, at any rate, is a shorter-odds proposition than the one I WANT to see:
"ASH HAGS TOLD TO SHUT UP BY DRINKS SPOKESMAN"
I'd lay 500 to 1 against THAT appearing in any newspaper in the near future.................
Well put Martin V the anti smoking brigade will be quick to pick up any perceived positives that will further their argument about our so called successful smoking ban. Unfortunately when the general public (read brainwashed) see the head lines in the local rags they will think what a good job were doing and us poor smokers wont get much of a say in this "going forward" society. Regardless, we still need a proper civilised smoking area for the banashed, other than the bus shelters we are now faced with resulting with a lot of bitter people. Its not good for society to have disenfranchised bitter and resentful citizens who feel they have been bullied, because there are always subtle backlashes. For instance my husband refused to do jury duty recently on the grounds that he was a smoker and there was no proper facilities to accomodate his legal habit. He also finds in his employment that there are frictions in households due to intolerences between smokers and non smokers when harmony should be the name of the game.
But lets continue our agitation and limited action 'going forward' its all we can do I guess until the tide turns.
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