Never work with children
Sunday, March 9, 2008 Last night, for the third time in four weeks, I was a guest on Five Live's Stephen Nolan Show. This time it was to discuss what Nolan called a "Five Live exclusive" - the claim, by Liverpool's Alder Hey Hospital, that up to a third of the children it treats for certain conditions are ill because their parents smoke in front of them. (Full story HERE.)
I armed myself with appropriate notes but it was no use. The adults, myself included, were completely upstaged by two children - a remarkably articulate 14-year-old boy whose hatred of tobacco smoke and concern for his mother and stepfather's health had persuaded them to stop smoking, and a 10-year-old girl who wanted her mother to quit before her "addiction" killed the pair of them.
Together they made an extraordinary double-act and dominated the programme to such an extent that at one point Nolan decided to butt out and let them speak to one another directly without interruption.
Outgunned by tales of woe from various listeners, the girl's mother was equally impressive with her quiet determination to smoke in a well-ventilated room in her own home. By the end, however, even she was on the verge of conceding the argument in order to mollify her sweet but increasingly opinionated child.
You can hear the discussion HERE for the next seven days. It's at the start of the programme and continues for about 45 minutes. My (brief) contribution comes at the start and end of the discussion. In between I gave up the unequal contest and watched Match of the Day instead.
Never work with children? Never work with anti-smoking children!!
Reader Comments (11)
I listened to the morning programme. I along with others emailed and said that for decades, smoking had deceased and cars had increased, yet asthma had increased. A doctor responded by saying that asthma had reduced, thus proving his point.He even said that car exhausts had improved, but made no mention in the amount of diesel vehicles on our roads, The Norwich Union state that asthma in children has increased sixfold in the last 25 years. My maths tell me that there is no doubt that vehicles are the mayor cause and I don't need any doctor or so called 'expert' to tell me that my sums don't add up. Alders Hey did not carry out their own reseach, but was using a report from America.
I did not hear the programme, but from what I read, it sounded absolutely awful, and riddiculously unfair, in the fact, that if any of the adults concerned tried to put up a forcefull argument with the children, they would have been castigated for speaking to children in such a way.
A few weeks ago,I mentioned to Forest, a BBC children's programme entitled "The Smoke House" where children bullied and cajoled their parents into stopping smoking, all in the name of "education" of course (what was the teacher's name, Hitler?) But Forest didn't seem to think there was any problem with this, and didn't bother to publicise the story, in order for members, and anyone else, to complain about such a biased programme, to the BBC.
Now, perhaps, they will see, that they should have taken more notice, as even their own spokeperson, Simon Clark, was silenced by these little monsters.
Anyone remember the 60s cult film, "Children of the Damned"?
Emoitional blackmail, a typical Nazi tool.
Well-versed, extremely opinionated children can lead people to accept extreme measues.
A scientific debate? The doctor KNOWS he was lying.That's how far removed fron truth this has become.An absolute disgrace!
You CANNOT debate with this 'scum'. They will stoop to any actions, however dispicable, to make sure everyone is brainwashed, and abide by their doctrine of hate.
The science is there to prove the lies, so they MUST be accused and challenged in the strongest possible terms,in public.
Forest can debate all they like, but it NEVER works, as we have seen. Calling for the resignation of the 'criminal' Liam Donaldson, would be a good start. It may seem fairy tale stuff, but using the Antis own method, repeat, repeat, repeat, dirt sticks.
GIGANTIC lies have been told, and this must be repeated every day in no uncertain terms to the media. It's time to get very tough.
Well, we might as well volunteer to line ourselves up to be shot for the selfish, irresponsible, abusive addicts that we are!
Thank God for the mother of the 10 year old who was the only member of the public to offer some balance to the "debate". The most ghastly aspect is that the views of Mr and Mrs Public once would have been exposed for what they are - opinion based on personal dislike and prejudice - but now are being mirrored and given authority by the professionals whose pronouncements are accepted without anyone demanding robust justification.
As for the 14 year old, James, although I thought that he came across as a likeable and mature child, a child is what he is. Had I been his mother, instead of agreeing to his demands that I stop smoking, I would have told him that it is not his place to tell any adult how to behave. Given the flimsy nature of the "evidence" on ETS, the indocrination in schools that informs the likes of James is utterly irresponsible and inexcusable.
I have said before that my generation of primary school children lived in blackout-sealed, coal-heated houses, where usually at least one adult smoked and the fathers as well, when on leave from the services. We were very healthy, active, sport-loving children. I may just recall hearing of one child who suffered from asthma but no more. I cannot believe that campaigning zealots really understand what they are doing in undermining impressionable youngsters' sense of security in their own family life.
Indoctrinating the young seems to be where it's at, if you're a fascist.
I'm not going to listen to the radio "debate", as from Simon's description it seems like it would be painful.
What is most frightening is that these children will consider their beliefs beyond reproach. Children - and especially adolescents - are like that. They need to belong.
Therefore it is the duty of people like Nolan to keep the little b******s at bay.
The very idea of children telling adults what to do is macabre, sinister and perverse. I firmly believe that children should know their place. That's already an impossible dream - yet the education system is being re-tooled to purposely fill children with "opinions" since, apparently, "learning" and "facts" are elitist concepts. What will tomorrow's children be like? The mind boggles.
I'd go so far as to say that children and perhaps teenagers should be categorically barred from public debates - especially when it concerns issues like this. They don't know their own minds, they don't know the realities of life, they don't know jack. They never have anything interesting to say. All they know is the current, trendy line, and in their desperation to belong they will believe that line no matter what.
Given all that, I think it is rather suspicious that the BBC would invite kids into a debating programme in the first place. What did they expect? That the kids were going to have some shockingly controversial opinions?! That their ability to reason would be superior to that of adults, who have fully developed brains and life experience?!
I don't care how articulate this 14 year-old boy is. He's 14 years old. He should shut the hell up.
I thought you did fine Simon. I don't see the point of putting children on these programmes. At best they know nothing - at worst they are obnoxious. The girl wasn't so bad - probably because of her mother, who described the girl has having a tendency to the dramatic.
"addiction" - does that mean you don't think smoking is addictive. Pull the other one!
Dan, I take it that you have never smoked?
I've known smokers who smoked only when socialising with friends and who would go for days without smoking; I've known smokers who smoked only in the evening or in particular places. I knew a smoker who smoked one a day. I don't consider these people to exhibit addiction.
You are absolutely right Joyce.
Your analysis of smokers fits in perfectly with myself. I never smoke during the day, except when I am on holiday, and obviously feel more relaxed. When I do smoke during the evening, it is always after my main meal, and then possibly another one or two at the most during the evening. If it's a special evening, I might indulge in a cigar.
Hardly what I would call addictive?
There's two curious things about so-called nicotine addiction. If it was 'the most addictive drug on the planet' as the propaganda never fails to tell us, then EVERYONE using nicotine replacement products would instantly become addicted to them. By the way, there is no such thing as 'theraputic nicotine', it'a ALL the same however you receive it.
The other curiosity concerns passive smoking, for there is no doubt, again given the propagand, that anyone exposed to this for a few hours would HAVE TO BECOME ADDICTED. Has anyone ever met a person addicted to secondhand smoke?.....No, I thought not.