Wednesday
Dec172008
Just fancy that!
Wednesday, December 17, 2008 The Daily Mail today reveals that "The ban on smoking in public has failed to increase the number of people quitting". It adds: "A survey of almost 7,000 across all age groups found on average there was no change in the number of cigarettes that smokers said they had. But in men aged 16 to 34, the number rose, by one and a half cigarettes a day." The figures, says the paper, "are a massive blow to Labour's public heath policy".
Full story, including Forest's response, HERE.
Reader Comments (10)
I'm glad that the Mail published that revealing survey but they're only telling us smokers what we already know that its all been spin and lies. For instance it was stated that heart attacks had been reduced, while only four weeks ago a survey showed that heart attacks had increased by 20% in ireland in the past 10years.
And how come that the smoking ban is generally ignored in germany and spain while being strictly adhered to in england and the isles ruining their hospitality industry.
And how come in california and most parts of america smoking is allowed indoors in small family owned bars, smoking lounges and fully covered outdoor areas.
This all proves that smokers and pub owners expecially should now demand an indoor smoking area. They could even employ a volenteer worker who smokes, especially now that second hand smoke has been shown up for the sham it is.
Pubs are meant to be a place of social intercourse not places of alienation that they have become since the smoking ban.
The labour govt is so unbelievably thick by not thinking past plan A. Did they seriously think that smoking was not going to increase dramatically in the home post ban.
Seems to me they just looked at the smoking ban as a means of extra jobs and big salaries to keep themselves in employment and the rest was all a pack of cards that hopefully now will come tumbling down and shown up for the outrageous waste of money and disaster it all has been.
Also legislators would want to get real and start thinking about allowing an indoor smoking area in restaurants too before any more of them go to the wall like the pubs especially in these recessionery times.
A right kick in Labour's smug holier-than-thou chops, isn't it?
I've had a rant about it too
Lies and Labour
How on earth do they continue to get away with it?
No other law or legislation in this country, or any other civilised country in the world, would be allowed to be implemented, based entirely upon unproven, so called "facts and figures".
Just a few days ago, we were being told that cigarettes and all other tobacco goods, should be banned from top shelf display. We were also told, that cigarette packaging should be in plain packets. The reason for this, we were told by our honest, and ever caring Government and their agents, was to help stop children and young people from smoking. In fact, the whole smoking ban experiment, was supposedly implemented, to do exactly this. It would drastically cut down the "dreadful habit", they told us, and in doing so, save thousands, or possibly millions of lives.
Now, as these new figures are revealed, showing smoking to have actually increased in the UK, since the smoking ban came into place, just as it also has in France, and possibly many other countries, so our Government now decide to change the goalposts. The smoking ban experiment, they now say, was not meant to help people quit smoking at all, it was implemented purely to protect employees and the public from the harmful effects of second-hand smoke.
If this really was the case, then why have they been telling us this other story for so long? And why call for cigarettes to be sold in plain packaging, and from under the counter? Surely a plain white packet of cigarettes, sold from under a newsagent's counter, emits exactly the same amount of second-hand smoke as the old fashioned printed pack, sold from the shelf?
This latest set of figures, proves beyond any doubt that the smoking ban experiment has failed dismally. It has helped to close down many businesses throughout the country, and has put thousands of people out of work. It is based upon lies, and implemented by ministers, who care little for the truth or the rights of the electorate.
The smoking ban experiment must be overhauled now. A substantial, and it would seem, ever growing, number of the population of this country are smokers by choice, and as such, they are entitled to the same freedom of choice as their non smoking counterparts.
This draconian law must be changed.
When are ASH receiving their P45s ?
How the hell can anyone justify the smoking ban now?
The smoking ban cannot be justified Dave. It has even reversed a downward trend of smoking prevalence, which was its main aim, even if the legislation was put through for other reasons.
They will argue about the right of workers to work in 'smoke-free' areas. They can still have their 'smoke-free' areas if some element of choice was provided, so to me that is a non-starter.
The ban has failed. Smoking rates up, heart attacks in Scotland up, business failures up, people out of work up, communities broken up, hatred up. ASH have got an awful lot of answering to do.
Prohibition and legislation was never the answer to tackling this issue, just like it won't be with obesity and alchohol. Education is the only real answer and allowing people to make their own life-style choices.
It's no wonder people are taking to the streets in a drunken rage, or eating comfort food in these times. This government with its heavy-handed legislation, has driven many citizens to this.
How the hell can anyone justify the smoking ban now? - Dave Atherton.
Exactly! They seem to have had two separate justifications for the ban, depending on which antismoker you're talking to.
One bunch justified the ban on the grounds of 'protecting bar staff', but most of the research has shown that passive smoking is (as Sir Richard Doll once said) perfectly harmless. They can only continue to say this by ignoring most of the research, and cherry-picking the studies that fit their agenda.
The other bunch, which includes Julian Le Grand, who has been mentioned in these threads, concede that the evidence against passive smoking is pretty thin, and their justification for the ban is that it will 'help' smokers to give up smoking. Now that justification is looking decidedly hollow as well.
Meanwhile, this futile ban has created division and resentment across the whole country, and will cost Labour dearly in votes that it badly needs. A half-sensible government would concede that the ban has been a failure, and that it was never justified in the first place, and move quickly to relax the ban before the other political parties start using the issue as another stick with which to beat this hapless government.
In this respect it's a bit rich that Liberal Democrat health spokesman Norman Lamb should say: 'These are pretty stark figures which demonstrate forcefully that the Government's strategy on smoking has not been successful', given that he voted for a complete ban (along with 95% of Liberal MPs).
This ban is going to haunt both the Lib Dems and Labour for a long time. Fortunately most Tories had the good sense to vote against the total ban. And I say that as a long term Lib Dem voter who isn't going to vote for them again.
P.S. Ann, the smoking 'ban' in Spain permits bars and cafes with a floor area of less than 100 square metres to allow smoking, which most of them do. So the ban is in no sense as draconian and divisive as the British ban. Furthermore, just last week the Generalitat of Catalonia decided that it would not press for stricter smoking bans. (Spanish link).
Also over 100 sq. metres no smoking in restaurant area ( some do ) but smoking allowed at the bar.
Mary, I quite agree that Education with regard to smoking, obesity and drink. The problem lies with the fact that this disastrous government have no idea how to educate! They have failed in schools, colleges and universities, they have failed miserably with sex education, so they would obviously fail with these other issues. Therefore, we get the 'ban it' mentality, which to my mind is a sign of the dismal failure they have been over the past 11 years and if they can't manage some success over this period of time there is absolutely no hope for them. The problem is they have managed to drag many of their opposition down with them, by working on the principle that Bullshit Baffles Brains! Having said that, I am doubtful there are enough brains in parliament to be baffled!
I second that, a mighty political shift is needed immediately to close down the unelected, unaccountable liars and spin doctors in the EU who were the engineers of the smoking ban in the first place.
When lies come from the top its inevitable that it filters down the chain. Other govts hop on the band wagon too when they see the money that can be made so easily from lies and spin and start setting up health agencies like Ash and just sit back and watch all the dosh roll in.
Its called a smokescreen, get the plebes diverted with trivia and lies like smoking, drinking, rubbish bans etc and behind the scenes put through dictatorship laws and then when the plebes cop on, like the recent arrest of the MP Damien Green, find out its too late.